DM workshop follow-up and status #2

Gerard Lemson glemson1 at jhu.edu
Mon Mar 22 16:26:23 CET 2021 

Hi Laurent
Thanks.
I will use the issues, sorry for forgetting about that.
> Models imported by MANGO are listed in MANGO-VODML, this is why the mapping does not detail that list.
It was the mango model itself that I did not see in the mapped VOTable. But I will add these to the issues as well.
Cheers
Gerard

From: Laurent Michel <laurent.michel at astro.unistra.fr>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2021 11:23
To: Gerard Lemson <glemson1 at jhu.edu>
Cc: dm at ivoa.net
Subject: Re: DM workshop follow-up and status #2

Gerard,

Thank you for your comments.
If you have others comments, please, put them on the dm-usecases issues.

You are right, most of the Mango proposals haven't been updated to the curent model version (the last one):
- Mapping of current MANGO version that removed the reduction status field
- Mapping block head (MODEL-INSTANCE) with both model names and urls.

I've just complete a PR.

MANGO will remain frozen until the data challenge is complete, so you can use the last version.
This shouldn't prevent you to raise issues on the MANGO project.

Models imported by MANGO are listed in MANGO-VODML, this is why the mapping does not detail that list.

Laurent



On 21 Mar 2021, at 15:07, Gerard Lemson <glemson1 at jhu.edu<mailto:glemson1 at jhu.edu>> wrote:

Hi Laurent
> From: Laurent Michel laurent.michel at astro.unistra.fr<mailto:laurent.michel at astro.unistra.fr>
>Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2021 5:19
> To: Gerard Lemson glemson1 at jhu.edu<mailto:glemson1 at jhu.edu>
> Subject: Re: DM workshop follow-up and status #2

> Gerard,

> The repo is here:
>    https://github.com/ivoa-std/MANGO<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fivoa-std%2FMANGO&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050334045%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=GV7AYAuCf4OYCpwOyLnNKfGCzfRgXLHe9w8aMUr6qwA%3D&reserved=0>
> ...
> Notice the the model might change a little bit after the recent reviews (MCD, FB, ML) See the issue pages

Yes, in that repo for that is where I had found the particular commit I asked about:
https://raw.githubusercontent.com/ivoa-std/MANGO/a46441f6fc498a6aeb33ed97e65689fee3d00f6c/vo-dml/mango.vo-dml.xml<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fraw.githubusercontent.com%2Fivoa-std%2FMANGO%2Fa46441f6fc498a6aeb33ed97e65689fee3d00f6c%2Fvo-dml%2Fmango.vo-dml.xml&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050344040%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=JXNBuKRxeDs3NhhRC6xW2ykP%2Bf7pWbDK7QsmwfK3jHw%3D&reserved=0>

Indeed to keep things constant I want to use a particular (raw) commit for the model rather than relying on https://github.com/ivoa-std/MANGO/blob/master/vo-dml/mango.vo-dml.xml<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fivoa-std%2FMANGO%2Fblob%2Fmaster%2Fvo-dml%2Fmango.vo-dml.xml&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050354033%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=UJ%2F9lN0fWwHMBDCyyLkY4IBMp6Ic3vlqqVTYiHr9t5I%3D&reserved=0> . So I guess I will use the one I wrote in my email. Note that I would also prefer to use a permanent version because if the model linked to by a particular mapping changes, the mapping may no longer be valid.

But I also was curious which one you used for example in
https://github.com/ivoa/dm-usecases/blob/main/usecases/combined_data/mango_proposal/4xmm_litewithsp.annot.xml<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fivoa%2Fdm-usecases%2Fblob%2Fmain%2Fusecases%2Fcombined_data%2Fmango_proposal%2F4xmm_litewithsp.annot.xml&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050354033%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=qaIe0eyxOUMj0TDXuCgCq8bmg%2BAljCmU1serA0A0qzY%3D&reserved=0>
In that mapping you use, but do not declare the mango model.

And in that mapping I see clauses like

<ATTRIBUTE dmrole="mango:Parameter.reductionStatus" dmtype="ivoa:string" value="Corrected" />
<INSTANCE dmrole="mango:Parameter.measure" dmtype="mango:stcextend.LonLatSkyPosition">

At https://github.com/ivoa/dm-usecases/blob/cd3760e345be139e645393c1159dd32e80001ab8/usecases/combined_data/mango_proposal/4xmm_litewithsp.annot.xml#L64<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fivoa%2Fdm-usecases%2Fblob%2Fcd3760e345be139e645393c1159dd32e80001ab8%2Fusecases%2Fcombined_data%2Fmango_proposal%2F4xmm_litewithsp.annot.xml%23L64&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050364031%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=pJx7m9PtfnlCED1EMkcwheLa%2FW5kiZH0BECa1v6Lg3s%3D&reserved=0>

But in the model you link to I don't find these roles.
Indeed I also don't find the type MangoObject used in dmtype="mango:MangoObject" in https://github.com/ivoa/dm-usecases/blob/cd3760e345be139e645393c1159dd32e80001ab8/usecases/combined_data/mango_proposal/4xmm_litewithsp.annot.xml#L35<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fivoa%2Fdm-usecases%2Fblob%2Fcd3760e345be139e645393c1159dd32e80001ab8%2Fusecases%2Fcombined_data%2Fmango_proposal%2F4xmm_litewithsp.annot.xml%23L35&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050364031%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=qvdTSUsVwYpFQ%2FKECAuZRlU9HwDAVmIUiXdsuW7wmTc%3D&reserved=0>

If we want to do comparisons between different mapping prescriptions wouldn't it be good to all at least use the same version of the same model?
Same if we want to look at the applicability of a model to describe certain votable-s?

Cheers
Gerard


On 20 Mar 2021, at 23:37, Gerard Lemson <glemson1 at jhu.edu<mailto:glemson1 at jhu.edu>> wrote:

HI Laurent
What is the location of the Mango model's VO-DML you use in your mappings?
If I use the latest master commit https://raw.githubusercontent.com/ivoa-std/MANGO/a46441f6fc498a6aeb33ed97e65689fee3d00f6c/vo-dml/mango.vo-dml.xml<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fraw.githubusercontent.com%2Fivoa-std%2FMANGO%2Fa46441f6fc498a6aeb33ed97e65689fee3d00f6c%2Fvo-dml%2Fmango.vo-dml.xml&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050374027%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=lujhCu78K9WFdqveVVNAlyazMD2ps6pUGRS5Iy8w%2BQ8%3D&reserved=0> , should that correspond to the version you map to in your examples?
Thanks
Gerard


From: interop-bounces at ivoa.net<mailto:interop-bounces at ivoa.net> <interop-bounces at ivoa.net<mailto:interop-bounces at ivoa.net>> On Behalf Of Laurent Michel
Sent: Friday, March 19, 2021 13:11
To: dm at ivoa.net<mailto:dm at ivoa.net>; interop at ivoa.net<mailto:interop at ivoa.net>
Subject: DM workshop follow-up and status #2

Dear all,

3 Weeks after the kick-off meeting, the status of the use-case repository is as follow:

Catalog annotations:
    - All based on Mango
    - The annotations are based on either VODML-mapping proposal (MCD) or ModelInstanceInVot (LM)

Time Series Annotations
    - Based on either Cube DM (MCD) or on MD's approach based on a loose use of model components
    - The annotations are based on either VODML-mapping proposal (MCD) or ModelInstanceInVot (LM)

All data samples are documented:
There are a lot of discussions in the issues and some inputs on the Wiki.
The main topic is to decide wether one must use sparse models element or more integrated models

We plan to start the synthesis work in April, so interested people are welcome to contribute in any way.
You can participate or follow the discussions on either issues, Wiki or Pull Request threads:

Repository:
    https://github.com/ivoa/dm-usecases<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fivoa%2Fdm-usecases&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050374027%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=WyTnAFHl7z%2FPRd9nGkssXKXYu5jXPuStVfH%2BiS2kfA0%3D&reserved=0>

Proposal dashboard:
    https://github.com/ivoa/dm-usecases/blob/main/usecases/README.md<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fivoa%2Fdm-usecases%2Fblob%2Fmain%2Fusecases%2FREADME.md&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050384021%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=A6wbjoFmnZbQHLJK8G9Gt3MciwAMrhZISaE4wUK27Ic%3D&reserved=0>

Wiki contributions:
    https://github.com/ivoa/dm-usecases/wiki/<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fivoa%2Fdm-usecases%2Fwiki%2F&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050384021%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=qRHSYQJyCYiL8eP%2BP%2BeKDgTuQ4lqnhfpq0kyg12SPOs%3D&reserved=0>


Laurent

Useful links:
    https://github.com/ivoa-std/MANGO<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fivoa-std%2FMANGO&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050394011%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=2XKmiW5TBijDSkuZ5seUKsvzydFIYk%2BTkVnYQotu88Y%3D&reserved=0>
    https://github.com/ivoa-std/ModelInstanceInVot<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fivoa-std%2FModelInstanceInVot&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050394011%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2BRX7Finy8Ci8ch97UhDzrTMJNLa2J%2F0l%2BOlWY%2FZDV8w%3D&reserved=0>
    https://volute.g-vo.org/svn/trunk/projects/dm/Cube/<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fvolute.g-vo.org%2Fsvn%2Ftrunk%2Fprojects%2Fdm%2FCube%2F&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050404010%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=ZBUUm1zeiJT7b4TlwkaTuVzM91gBblCqvIFzZ%2BpqzlM%3D&reserved=0>



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Laurent Michel
SSC XMM-Newton
Tél : +33 (0)3 68 85 24 37
Fax : +33 (0)3 )3 68 85 24 32
Université de Strasbourg <http://www.unistra.fr<https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.unistra.fr%2F&data=04%7C01%7Cglemson1%40jhu.edu%7C8668bbcac337494662fb08d8ed466e30%7C9fa4f438b1e6473b803f86f8aedf0dec%7C0%7C0%7C637520234050414002%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=7%2FP5q8V37kMES0WJTNO8cG7MYtrV1TFIwfhONDU0T7Y%3D&reserved=0>>
Observatoire Astronomique
11 Rue de l'Université
F - 67200 Strasbourg

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