SLAP2 and the data-source vocabulary

[Markus Demleitner]

Dear Stéphane,

Thanks for your input on data-source.

On Wed, Sep 16, 2026 at 01:53:16PM +0200, Stéphane Erard wrote:
> Lab: — this is usually called Experimental
> Doing measurements using [artificial — no] samples in laboratory-like environments.
> (think of meteorites, lunar samples.... : not artificial at all)
> — my point was it is important to keep it separated from
> observations, so this is _not_ a child of Observation

Hm, well... :-)  If you identify #observation with the previous
*#in-situ (I've dropped this now that #experimental is top-level),
it's not, yes.  And perhaps a common wider term for #observation and
#experimental really isn't necessary.

> The specific point is controlled environment & conditions

Ok, in

https://www.ivoa.net/rdf/data-source/2026-09-23/data-source.html

[obligatory reminder: URLs into vocabularies never have dates in them
outside of development], there's now #experimental with the
definition

  Doing measurements in controlled, laboratory-like environments.

> Observation
> I agree this is difficult to describe...
> In our field this is always related to telescopes or space missions
> I think. The mention of the actual world is unusual

I had put this in to somehow hint at the comparability with
concrete-model, but I give you it's implied.  So, this definition is
now

  The use of instruments to directly measure or observe objects or
  phenomena. Subsequent reduction steps are allowed, even if they are
  significant (e.g., remapping), but a direct path must link most
  bits in resulting data to a sensor reading or messenger particle.

The thing with reduction steps tries to hint at subtle borders
between observation and simulation e.g., in high energy astrophysics
or GW physics.  I can't say I'm too happy with "most bits", but it's
the best I could come up with.

> cases which would be classified arbitrarily. What may be more
> relevant is evolving systems (iterative computations) vs
> reproduction of a final state (ie: finding the proper parameter
> values)

Are there discovery cases that would suggest introducing separate
concepts for those?

So... what do you, what does everyone else think about
<https://www.ivoa.net/rdf/data-source/2026-09-23/data-source.html>?
VODataService (which this vocabulary will be reviewed with) is going
for RFC RSN, and it would be cool if the reviewers had something that
at least we over here can somewhat agree upon...

Thanks,

         Markus