<div dir="ltr">Dear all,<div>my feelings are along the lines of Christophe&#39;s ones.</div><div><br></div><div>So, not to create any controversial issue, I&#39;ll skip this round of job posting.</div><div>Not sure I&#39;ll post it to the <span class="" id=":1ex.1" tabindex="-1" style="">interop</span> list, I was undecided already last time I did.</div><div><br></div><div>At this point I wonder if, on the <span class="" id=":1ex.2" tabindex="-1" style="">IVOA</span> web page, there could be a dedicated place for this kind of things: i.e. a &quot;work with <span class="" id=":1ex.3" tabindex="-1" style="">IVOA</span> members and contributors&quot;-like space. This should prevent faking social news while letting people understand there&#39;s place for work within the <span class="" id=":1ex.4" tabindex="-1" style="">VO</span> community and helping in posting job ads.</div><div><br></div><div>Cheers,</div><div>     Marco</div><div><br></div><div>PS - the job was really <span class="" id=":1ex.5" tabindex="-1" style="">VO</span> related in this case (another reason not to use it to feed this discussion, it would turn out in being a biasing information piece): it&#39;s about disseminating <span class="" id=":1ex.6" tabindex="-1" style="">VO</span> knowledge and solutions while, probably, renovating <span class="" id=":1ex.7" tabindex="-1" style="">VObs</span>.it pages (nearly dead currently) and, maybe, helping in maintaining the <span class="" id=":1ex.8" tabindex="-1" style="">TWiki</span>-Mailman-mail service of <span class="" id=":1ex.9" tabindex="-1" style="">IVOA</span> based in Trieste.</div><div><br></div><div><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote">2018-01-19 8:49 GMT+01:00 Christophe <span class="" id=":1ex.10" tabindex="-1" style="">Arviset</span> <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:Christophe.Arviset@esa.int" target="_blank">Christophe.<span class="" id=":1ex.11" tabindex="-1" style="">Arviset</span>@<span class="" id=":1ex.12" tabindex="-1" style="">esa</span>.int</a>&gt;</span>:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
  
    
  
  <div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
    <p>Dear all</p>
    <p>I have mixed feeling on this matter. On one side, I agree to the
      point that it would be difficult to fully determine what is the VO
      job or not and Simon indeed pointed out a good group for jobs for
      astronomers (there is also the LinkedIn on Astronomy and Space
      Software (<a class="m_-6402175381864514686moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.linkedin.com/groups/70811" target="_blank">https://www.linkedin.com/<wbr>groups/70811</a>). On the other
      side, I would not want to systematically ban any job posting as
      there might be some very specific ones purely VO (such as emerging
      from EC funded projects) that would be natural to post there.</p>
    <p>I hope this helps.</p>
    <p>Cheers</p>
    <p>Christophe <br>
    </p><div><div class="h5">
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <br>
    <div class="m_-6402175381864514686moz-cite-prefix">On 18/01/2018 11:24 PM, Simon O&#39;Toole
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite">
      
      <div>Hi all,</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>Just putting in my two cents worth: I agree that we
        should not be posting job ads on the IVOA social media accounts.
        Mainly because, as Bruce says, it is often hard to distinguish a
        VO-related job ad from a non-VO-related one. We don’t want to
        annoy people with a somewhat arbitrary cutoff (“Why did they
        post that ad when they didn’t post mine!!”). Also, there is a
        great Facebook group already for jobs: Jobs for Astronomers.</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>Cheers,</div>
      <div>Simon</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <br>
      <div>
        <blockquote type="cite">
          <div>On 19 Jan 2018, at 5:35 AM, Bruce Berriman &lt;<a href="mailto:GBB@ipac.caltech.edu" target="_blank">GBB@ipac.caltech.edu</a>&gt; wrote:</div>
          <br class="m_-6402175381864514686Apple-interchange-newline">
          <div>
            
            <div style="word-wrap:break-word">Hi Jamie,
              <div><br>
              </div>
              <div>Please see below!</div>
              <div><br>
              </div>
              <div>Bruce</div>
              <div><br>
                <div>
                  <div>
                    <blockquote type="cite">
                      <div>On Jan 18, 2018, at 12:43 PM,
                        Budynkiewicz, Jamie Anne &lt;<a href="mailto:jbudynkiewicz@cfa.harvard.edu" target="_blank">jbudynkiewicz@cfa.harvard.edu</a><wbr>&gt;
                        wrote:</div>
                      <br class="m_-6402175381864514686Apple-interchange-newline">
                      <div>
                        <div dir="ltr">Hi Bruce,
                          <div><br>
                          </div>
                          <div>Thanks for the quick input. In
                            hindsight, I was a bit hasty on this.
                            Apologies on that.</div>
                          <div class="gmail_extra">
                            <div class="gmail_quote"><br>
                              <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                                <div style="word-wrap:break-word">
                                  <div>Having a “catch-all” for
                                    information will, in my view,
                                    diminish the impact of our social
                                    media efforts.</div>
                                  <div><br>
                                  </div>
                                </div>
                              </blockquote>
                              <div>I agree with this -- we
                                don&#39;t want to add too much
                                technical/insider material to the
                                pages.  I feel if the job were strictly
                                VO-related, it&#39;d be fine to post it on
                                facebook or twitter. At least it shows
                                there are jobs for VO-work or ones that
                                request knowledge of VO.  If Marco&#39;s job
                                posting is directly VO-related, perhaps
                                we could post something more for the
                                general public on facebook/twitter
                                before hand?  Does that help?  </div>
                              <div><br>
                              </div>
                              <div>Or, we can just state the
                                policy, &quot;No job postings on the social
                                media platforms&quot; if that makes the most
                                sense.</div>
                            </div>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                    </blockquote>
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    My view is not to do job postings in tis way. It can
                    often be hard to discriminate what is really a VO
                    job from what is not - in the sense that jobs tend
                    to have several roles, and the VO part may be the
                    least significant, and we should not be advertising
                    such. I am, however, happy to listen to alternative
                    views on this topic from the media group.</div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div>Cheers</div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div>Bruce</div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div><br>
                    <blockquote type="cite">
                      <div>
                        <div dir="ltr">
                          <div class="gmail_extra">
                            <div class="gmail_quote">
                              <div><br>
                              </div>
                              <div>Thanks,</div>
                              <div>Jamie</div>
                            </div>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                        <span class="m_-6402175381864514686BEGIN-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS"></span>
                        <div class="m_-6402175381864514686BEGIN-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS" style="display:inline">
                          
                          <div><span style="font-size:inherit;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;background-color:white;display:inline">
                              <hr>
                              <br>
                              <a href="https://canit.ipac.caltech.edu/canit/b.php?c=s&amp;i=01UXRHPhu&amp;m=5edf4d7ddce4" target="_blank">Spam</a><br>
                              <a href="https://canit.ipac.caltech.edu/canit/b.php?c=n&amp;i=01UXRHPhu&amp;m=5edf4d7ddce4" target="_blank">Not spam</a><br>
                              <a href="https://canit.ipac.caltech.edu/canit/b.php?c=f&amp;i=01UXRHPhu&amp;m=5edf4d7ddce4" target="_blank">Forget
                                previous vote</a><br>
                            </span></div>
                          
                        </div>
                        <span class="m_-6402175381864514686END-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS"></span>
                      </div>
                    </blockquote>
                  </div>
                  <br>
                </div>
              </div>
            </div>
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    </blockquote>
    <br>
    </div></div><pre class="m_-6402175381864514686moz-signature" cols="72">-- 
Thanks in advance

Cheers

Christophe


------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>-------
Christophe ARVISET                       <a class="m_-6402175381864514686moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Christophe.Arviset@esa.int" target="_blank">Christophe.Arviset@esa.int</a>

Head of the Data and Engineering Division
Operations Department, Directorate of Science
European Space Astronomy Centre (ESAC)
European Space Agency (ESA)

Camino Bajo del Castillo s/n
Urb. Villafranca del Castillo
28692 Villanueva de la Canada - Madrid        Tel: <a href="tel:+34%20918%2013%2012%2078" value="+34918131278" target="_blank">+34 91 813 12 78</a>
SPAIN                                         Mob: <a href="tel:+34%20655%2003%2043%2003" value="+34655034303" target="_blank">+34 655 03 43 03</a>
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