TAP, skynode, or boutique?

[John Good]

We have the functionality, but is was not part of
what we all agreed to show in the first prototypes
(similarly we did not include SQL/~ADQL querying
though we have that functionality, too).

Partly this was to avoid dealing with asynchronous
processing; you can't ask for a cross-match to an
uploaded table and assume that the results will
come streaming back.

- John



Douglas Tody wrote:

> Hi Roy -
> 
> We do plan to prototype this within NVO, although it is not included yet
> in the current prototypes.
> 
>     - Doug
> 
> 
> On Fri, 5 Sep 2008, Roy Williams wrote:
> 
>> This is fabulous Guy, thank you.
>>
>> Do you know anyone who is making/planning an implementation of TAP 
>> 3.3.6? In the US, there are several partial implementations of TAP 
>> being started, but nobody is doing that part of the spec.
>>
>> Roy
>>
>>
>> Guy Rixon wrote:
>>
>>> Roy,
>>>
>>> quoting from the TAP/PARAM draft that was current before the Trieste 
>>> meeting:
>>>
>>> *3.3.6 Multi-Position Queries *
>>> A /multi-position/ query generalizes POS, SIZE to a table of 
>>> positions, allowing an arbitrarily large number of spatial 
>>> position-based queries to be executed simultaneously.  In a typical 
>>> scenario the user uploads a list of the positions of their favorite 
>>> objects, and executes a spatial cross match against some data table.  
>>> The multi-position query provides this simple spatial cross match 
>>> capability. (full text at 
>>> http://www.ivoa.net/internal/IVOA/TableAccess/tap-v0.2.pdf)
>>>
>>> Unless the NVO people working on this have found problems, this is 
>>> still to be part of the initial TAP spec (we'll find next week when 
>>> we start to edit the proposals into a unified draft).
>>>
>>> Therefore, I would expect that you might be able to use TAP 
>>> installations for cross-match sometime this year with prototypes and 
>>> next year with production services.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Guy
>>>
>>>
>>> On 5 Sep 2008, at 16:14, Roy Williams wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dear DAL WG
>>>>
>>>> I am writing to ask if the Skynode protocol will continue to be 
>>>> supported in the broader IVOA. Most of the current implementations 
>>>> seem to be at Johns Hopkins University -- is that true? Are there 
>>>> other skynodes out there that are and will be properly maintained?
>>>>
>>>> A group of us in US-VO are developing an application (Vim) that 
>>>> handles multiple sky positions by running proximity (cone) searches 
>>>> against published catalogs. Thus a single click of the mouse can 
>>>> cause execution of a thousand separate cone searches against a 
>>>> single server. This can be very slow, and we would like to scale 
>>>> things up. We want a crossmatch service -- by which I mean no more 
>>>> than multiple cone searches. We want to do a thousand or a million 
>>>> cone searches in one "crossmatch" request.
>>>>
>>>> Which of these paths should the Vim team follow:
>>>>
>>>> (1) After years of discussion in this WG, I am still not seeing the 
>>>> emergence of anything like simple crossmatch in the TAP 
>>>> specification. So I guess we are still more years from widespread, 
>>>> solid implementation of TAP that can do crossmatch. Is that true?
>>>>
>>>> (2) The Skynode protocol can do crossmatch already, and I wonder if 
>>>> this is the direction the Vim team should follow instead of waiting 
>>>> for TAP. However, before doing this, we would really like an 
>>>> assurance that there will continue to be multiple organizations 
>>>> supporting Skynode!
>>>>
>>>> (3) The third way to get fast crossmatch would be to look through 
>>>> all the data center web pages looking for their own crossmatch 
>>>> services (eg [1][2][3]), and then build a custom interface from Vim 
>>>> to each data center.
>>>>
>>>> Thank you for your help
>>>> Roy
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [1] http://cas.sdss.org//dr6/en/tools/crossid/upload.asp
>>>> [2] 
>>>> http://irsa.ipac.caltech.edu/applications/Gator/GatorAid/Gator_Api.html
>>>> [3] http://vizier.cfa.harvard.edu/viz-bin/vizHelp?file.htx
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>>
>>>> California Institute of Technology
>>>> 626 395 3670
>>>
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>>
>> California Institute of Technology
>> 626 395 3670
>>